Ask an Atheist!!!

[danielsangeo]

It never ceases to amaze me, y’know, those that claim that the “complexity” of the human body indicates intelligent design?

They always attempt to explain it by using violent imagery such as “tornado in a junkyard constructing a functioning Boeing 747”. I believe it illustrates a fundamental misunderstanding of what “life” is and how it came to be.

You don’t go from a scattered jumble of material and leap a jillion steps ahead to a “functioning Boeing 747” in one fell swoop. Using the junkyard analogy more correctly, a tornado comes through the junkyard and wraps a piece of metal around a pole. Move that wrapped metal forward quickly and there’ll be more air pressure below the metal than there is above, creating lift.

The analogy is STILL bad, however, because it ignores a very fundamental fact that seriously demolishes ANY intelligent design argument. And it’s so basic that they don’t even see it:

A Boeing 747 is not alive.

[Seba]

@Burbinator

It says plenty about the daily life of individuals. The kind of houses they lived in, the kind of artefacts they used, etc.

But archeological digs don’t give you biographies of individuals, do they?

@RyviusRan

There are plenty of contemporary historians who wrote of Julia Caesar. Also many letters written by Caesar to other people. And over 900 letters written at the time describing Caesar.

@danielsangeo

Contemporary evidence is historical evidence from the time that corroborates the thing you’re talking about. If, say, you had an order from Pontius Pilate explicitly calling for the crucifixion of יְהוֹשֻׁעַ (Yĕhōšuă‘) (the original spelling of Jesus’ name), then you might have something.

Actually, that’s a very good point. Oral tradition can distort the original story, so at some point it becomes something completely different from the original. But it is also true that in most cases mythical stories are based on real, historical events - the battle of Troy is a fine example. Of course, this can just mean that Yehoshua was just some fanatic and a leader of a sect… :fffuuu:

[Soup]

@Seba

But archeological digs don’t give you biographies of individuals, do they?

Actually, that’s a very good point. Oral tradition can distort the original story, so at some point it becomes something completely different from the original. But it is also true that in most cases mythical stories are based on real, historical events - the battle of Troy is a fine example. Of course, this can just mean that Yehoshua was just some fanatic and a leader of a sect… :fffuuu:

Digs won’t give you “biographies”, they’ll give you something just as important in the forum of physical evidence. I really don’t see where you’re trying to go with this, because you seem woefully uninformed.

As I said before, it doesn’t matter if the story is distorted. If someone were to give an account of similar events now, no-one would give them any credence, when, by your logic, it would be at its most valuable.

[Bmsmg]

We have issues developing muscles, for starters.
Too little, and we have trouble moving. Too much, and our body breaks down. Compare that to certain bulls, who are born with muscles that are incredibly strong and take forever to atrophy.

Our skin has no fur or scales and is very thin.

We have trouble digesting uncooked food.

We have PUBERTY… which no other animal that I know of does.

We have no claws to speak of, bad teeth, and (as stated) weak muscles… our only real advantage is multi-jointed fingers, opposable thumbs, and and a high-power brain.

Our body is covered in nerves and arterys just below the skin, all of which are disabling if hurt.

Our brain’s first reaction, when presented with an immediate threat/Too Much Information, is to shut down until further notice.

We spend the first ten years developing. Then there is a ten year period where the growth process accelerates, which requires more fuel, leads to hostility, and can cause grievous injury.
We then have a twenty year period of being fit and powerful, but then slope down into a long decline of poor mental capacity and issues with memory and higher cognitive function, not to mention coordination and reproductive issues.
We also have a good memory, another advantage.

Most of us cannot see, hear, or smell worth shit. Our immune system is too fragile to go around licking everything, so that leaves us with touch and intuition.

What do you think the chances are of that species surviving evolution?

[RyviusRan]

@Bmsmg

What do you think the chances are of that species surviving evolution?

Pretty good because of our Brain and we lived in packs.

[Chrillen]

@Bmsmg

What do you think the chances are of that species surviving evolution?

One word: TOOLS.

Tools then led to AGRICULTURE.

And then agriculture led to CIVILIZATION.

[danielsangeo]

@Bmsmg

What do you think the chances are of that species surviving evolution?

Very good, because it happened. We have evidence it happened. We can trace our ancestral evolution backwards through the evolutionary tree to the point where we and other primates merged into our common ancestors.

If you think that all those “problems” you listed somehow prove that evolution is false, I have news for you: Those prove that there is no “design” and that evolution actually happened, even if you ignore all the historical evidence.

[bur]

@Bmsmg

We have issues developing muscles, for starters.
Too little, and we have trouble moving. Too much, and our body breaks down. Compare that to certain bulls, who are born with muscles that are incredibly strong and take forever to atrophy.

Our skin has no fur or scales and is very thin.

We have trouble digesting uncooked food.

We have PUBERTY… which no other animal that I know of does.

We have no claws to speak of, bad teeth, and (as stated) weak muscles… our only real advantage is multi-jointed fingers, opposable thumbs, and and a high-power brain.

Our body is covered in nerves and arterys just below the skin, all of which are disabling if hurt.

Our brain’s first reaction, when presented with an immediate threat/Too Much Information, is to shut down until further notice.

We spend the first ten years developing. Then there is a ten year period where the growth process accelerates, which requires more fuel, leads to hostility, and can cause grievous injury.
We then have a twenty year period of being fit and powerful, but then slope down into a long decline of poor mental capacity and issues with memory and higher cognitive function, not to mention coordination and reproductive issues.
We also have a good memory, another advantage.

Most of us cannot see, hear, or smell worth shit. Our immune system is too fragile to go around licking everything, so that leaves us with touch and intuition.

What do you think the chances are of that species surviving evolution?

Every disadvantage you named is easily offset by our brains and thumbs and speech.
It’s also all a result of evolution. Nothing “survives” evolution. They go through it, or die out.

[X_Mastershot_X]

Cancer is the new Evolution!

[COLOR=‘black’]
Just ignore me

[Bmsmg]

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it?
Yes, tools are useful, but how did we survive long enough to make them?
I see your point, however.
I also see that this thread is veering off-topic.

[Bolteh]

@Bmsmg

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it

No, you use your highly evolved brain to fool it by dropping down on the ground and pretending to be dead.

[RyviusRan]

@Bmsmg

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it?
Yes, tools are useful, but how did we survive long enough to make them?
I see your point, however.
I also see that this thread is veering off-topic.

There were no bears where primitive man lived.

[danielsangeo]

@Bmsmg

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it?
Yes, tools are useful, but how did we survive long enough to make them?
I see your point, however.
I also see that this thread is veering off-topic.

Perhaps you could read up on ancient man and you’d see the answers to your questions. All this stuff is freely available via the intertubes. This is an atheist questioning thread so if you make a topic about evolution, I might participate. Just know that all your questions have already been answered.

And, yes, you “out-rationalize” it by using that thing in your noggin and knowing that the creature (not a bear because they don’t exist yet) does not go for dead creatures, so you act dead.

[Surplus]

@Bmsmg

Our body is covered in nerves and arterys just below the skin, all of which are disabling if hurt.

Our brain’s first reaction, when presented with an immediate threat/Too Much Information, is to shut down until further notice.

We spend the first ten years developing. Then there is a ten year period where the growth process accelerates, which requires more fuel, leads to hostility, and can cause grievous injury.
We then have a twenty year period of being fit and powerful, but then slope down into a long decline of poor mental capacity and issues with memory and higher cognitive function, not to mention coordination and reproductive issues.
We also have a good memory, another advantage.

Most of us cannot see, hear, or smell worth shit. Our immune system is too fragile to go around licking everything, so that leaves us with touch and intuition.

Nerves are an advantage they let you know when to stop doing something, och that hurt I’d better stop.

Actually our brains respond with should i fight or run, i think your brain is malfunctioning.

Before technology the average life span for a human was 40 years, that means we spent half our lives being fit and powerful.

We work in packs some people can see and smell they tell other people hey I see something.

You had some good arguments but really you not looking at things in perspective not everything in the wild is a crazy fucking long sighted running killing machine

[Chrillen]

@Bmsmg

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it?
Yes, tools are useful, but how did we survive long enough to make them?
I see your point, however.
I also see that this thread is veering off-topic.

Because obviously people weren’t as weak back then as they are now. The body of the modern human is the result of not having to survive ‘n’ shit all day. And natural selection hardly plays a role within the human species any longer, so that explains any common modern diseases or weaknesses that might have spread.

[Mabilis]

@Bmsmg

So. You’re the first down from a tree. A bear charges you. You quickly apply your natural advantages and… out rationalize it?
Yes, tools are useful, but how did we survive long enough to make them?
I see your point, however.
I also see that this thread is veering off-topic.

How did we survive anyway, without shops?
modern idiot

[Bmsmg]

All right, I concede(again)
I just have one parting shot:

So that happened by pure accident?

[Bolteh]

I’m afraid I can’t follow you there. What happened by pure accident?

[danielsangeo]

Maybe he’s suggesting that Natalie Portman’s parents had her by accident? Condom malfunction or something? If that’s the case, how does Bmsmg know?

I don’t really know what Bmsmg is driving at, to be honest.

[Chrillen]

@Bmsmg

All right, I concede(again)
I just have one parting shot:

So that happened by pure accident?

No it’s not by accident (or chance), and you clearly don’t know anything about evolution and/or natural selection.