On A Rail Uncut - Re-Adding Cut Areas/Scenes (Expansion Project)

General Development Source 1
#121

Lol there’s logic to the blockage argument. The issue here is that the power puzzle in BMS C2A2A IS THE CLAW (at least obliquely). What you are doing in this section before B1 is essentially DUPLICATING the claw, which reintroduces a blockage element. Gameplay wise, this is redundant and you reinforce that redundancy w/a door. I tolerate the redundancy in the form of a claw on the grounds that it’s true to HL whereas the door is not. The security door is ALREADY present at the end of the claw puzzle which is a stone’s throw away.

In any case w/e. I do think you’re getting a bit too worked up over this door thing. Realistically, this segment of OaR should be retitled “On some Shoes,” both here and in HL. Once you get to the office complex, the vast majority of your travels are ON FOOT. You can’t expect to drive your tram simply through the middle of the HECU/vort battles…the BMS soldiers will gut you alive, and if not, the tripmine traps will at the bends. It’s like this section in HL was almost made as a deterrent to tram travel…only the electrified rails speak otherwise.

Also, assuming the player ditches the tram during your map, the next map that loads (BMS’ B ) instantly terminates tram travel anyway and takes you to another office complex, then the rocket where you get a new tram. So what I’m trying to say is that the on foot part really doesn’t last very long in the grand scheme of things. It’s only when you get to E-F that tram travel actually matters.

#122

Already a fight overthere, a bombarment on it? So a container felt down on the road…

Yeah No pedestrian access, electrified! Something like this?

#123

Are you talking about the turntable tram elevator after the hook that has the HECU on another elevator alongside it that goes up with you and has them shooting at you? If so I would say definitely keep it unless this is the exact part that BM already recreated. I don’t remember the turntable lift in BM I’ll have to play the chapter again today and see. I really liked that part though and the way it was designed was pretty interesting. You could jump onto the HECU elevator after killing them and end up going higher than the tram lift did to reach a suit charger and have a completely different view of the vort vs. HECU fight than if you take the tram initially.

As for going up twice being an issue. It’s not. When you go down into OaR from Power Up you’re already underground and even if you weren’t that doesn’t mean the section where you come up wasn’t built on higher terrain anyways.

Edit. Also congrats on ST Uncut getting a rock paper shotgun article. Looks like it will be getting a lot of new players now.

#124

The turntable w/HECU is in BMS…it’s just the HECU are sentry turrets now. That being said it would be nice to see this element replicated somewhere.

Edit
So it turns out that the materials transport theme is gonna be a little messed up in this remake. Here’s the appearance of the signs on the BMS maps:
C2A2A: Mat trans B
C2A2B: Mat trans C
C2A2C: Mat trans C
This means that unless you make some revisions to the labels, the remake of HL’s F and G are essentially all part of Mat trans C. The real nuisance here is just the BMS C2A2C label. If that were deleted, F and G could be made represent areas D and E respectively.

#125

How about, instead of the redundancy of the blockage AND a security door, you simply put large boxes on the end of the crane (which makes sense, given the material transport theme) and place them in a location that blocks the player whether they’re moving by rail or by foot? (for example, RIGHT in front of the tunnel, so they can see that there’s a tunnel behind it, but they can’t squeeze through).

#126

I think this is what TEXT was trying to do regarding the large crate (block both the rail path AND the side walkway). However it doesn’t fix the problem. What’s to keep you from proceeding on foot once you move the obstacle? TEXT’s door attempts to address this by making it mandatory for you to be on the tram in order to clear the area, but it really doesn’t fix the issue either. For instance, after clearing the door, I could simply fuck around and jump off the front of the tram and continue to proceed on foot.

Given the very reasonable design constraints set by the OaR dev (e.g. non-electrified rails, side walkways for realism), using the tram is and will always be a CHOICE in this chapter, not a mandatory requirement. Since the tram moves faster than the player can run, the best way to encourage this choice is to make long segments where it’s obviously more advantageous to take the tram (hence why tram travel is more important in HL’s E, F). Think the highway chapter in HL2…the car is really optional here, but given the rediculous amount of distance you have to cover on foot (w/battery limited sprint no less), who the hell would do this? For OaR, there’s no way to force the player to CONSISTENTLY use the tram, short of electrifying the rail system, but even then there’s still walkways that allow you to bypass it. That being said, it still might be worthwhile to test out the electrified rail in a beta and see how it affects game dynamics.

#127

I have decided to write up a sort of walk-through of the original Half-Life’s On A Rail chapter with the map names and what happens in each map chronologically along with screenshots and then links to a video play-through of the chapter.

Edit: Redacted. Moved to Page 10.

#128

What, you didn’t like my pitch bible?

The first C2A2C should be named C2A2B1.
C2A2F needs to be renamed C2A2E.
C2A2G needs to be renamed C2A2F.
C2A2H needs to be renamed C2A2G.
C2A2H is the rocket top and launch room, which you haven’t written up.

#129

You could probably do one of these things:

  1. Just have part of the track that dips down into deadly electrified water, forcing the player to use a tram.

  2. Have the track merge with another track that is currently blocked by a military train. Once you pass the crane area with the tram, the train will be gone (or moved) and you may continue. Alternatively you could have the engine of the military train accessible from another location, allowing you to manually move the train to the end of the track* so you may return to your tram and continue (though the concept is in-tact, it might be too different from the original design for your taste).

*the train won’t be a functional train, but a lever that you pull, making it run to the end of the track

EDIT: Whoops didn’t realise we were on a new page.

I don’t like your design mostly because it defeats the purpose of the chapter. If reach the rocket in the first half of the chapter, the entire second half is redundant. If you’re already there, going through the rest of the transport system is completely unnecessary. The sense of journey is ruined when you realise that you’re just riding around in a tram for the sake of riding around in a tram. Hence why I prefer all the maps to come before you arrive at the rocket, with the priming and launch being the last two.

#130

@Someguy
Lol tell that to the HL designers. They wanted to orient you to the rocket at three points on the map to reinforce that this was your goal. I simply agree w/their philosophy because I think it makes sense and also because I see it reflected in the products that they made afterwards (e.g. citadel as a constant visual presence, Gman sequences that show the endgame).

Using your suggestion, the ONLY mention of the rocket would be at the end of Power Up so then you go through this massive chapter where you see office complexes, materials transport areas and fight through a bunch of battles…by the time the player gets to the rocket, it will probably come more as a surprise that that was his goal because there’s been no visual cues to reinforce it. This is why I think Valve’s policy is better and it’s what I’m advocating in the pitch bible. It doesn’t matter to you much because you’re a HL vet, but I always design things from the perspective that the player is unfamiliar w/this game.

Edit
Also @ Jessie, your C2A2 should be C2A2A…all the other areas before it are irrelevant.

#131

Thanks I think it’s right now. And the pitch bible is great, but this is going to be simply an overview of exactly how the chapter was originally. I didn’t realize you already summed up most of the encounters. I will also take screenshots for each thing so anyone can see the basic design of each element.

While we’re on the subject of change though. I still don’t get the point of adding a whole new outdoor area as Text mentioned. I thought the outdoor section of OaR was handled well by BM. All that’s really missing is the sniper and the dynamite trap in the launch building, but I don’t believe Text plans on creating that trap as he doesn’t want to edit the old maps understandably. So what then is the point of adding an entire new outdoor section or even Skylights in the office part? That really doesn’t make a lot of sense to me as the offices in the original was still pretty far from when you reach the surface and at least a few floors below ground level. I think there’s plenty of underground sections that could be re-imagined without making them into outdoor areas while on a rail car. That never happened in the original.

I am really confused about this new outdoor part. Is the sniper really that important that we need a whole new area that didn’t exist before just so he can be put it?

#132

The skylights sound a little iffy to me too but we’ll see how that pans out. While the outdoor area was meant as a way to reintroduce the sniper, that was not the reason why I put forth the pitch. The area is simply meant to spice things up as an extension of the area from HL’s G, w/the reason being that too much of HL is indoors, which is boring (think Valve picked up on this too). The other reason why I proposed this pitch is because the outdoor area is useful for storytelling (image 10 pitch bible) and will provide TEXT w/a good place to showcase his creativity…he can really do it here either by extending the materials transport theme outdoors or introduce something entirely new. It’s a job portfolio thing.

Edit:
You can still introduce the second dynamite trap just before connecting to BMS’s C map. It would actually be pretty cool to see it re-imagined.

#133

In all honesty, I never even considered the possibility that the 3 rockets we saw in OAR were supposed to be the same one. Regardless of it it was the same or different, we only see one rocket in Black Mesa’s OAR, the one we are supposed to prime and fire.

As far as goals go, I don’t see that as a problem. In Unforeseen Consequences, we are told to head to the surface and try to contact help. Then in Office Complex we learn that help has already arrived, we just need to reach it. Then the entirety of “We’ve Got Hostiles” is you wondering aimlessly through the facility trying to survive the Military Assault. At the end of WGH, we’re told to head for the Lambda Complex. Instead we get stuck in Blast Pit and our new objective is to activate the test rockets to kill the Alien. It’s not until the end of Power Up, that we’re told to fire the rocket.

I could go on, but my point is, the entire game after WGH revolves around trying to reach the Lambda Complex, with major distractions (Tentacle, Garg, Rocket Launch, Capture) every couple chapters. If we can cope with that, I think we can cope with having one chapter with one goal. You’re even told “when you find the rocket- if you find the rocket”, which implies it’s supposed to be difficult to find. But once you finally get there, it’ll be clear what you must do.

Made a crappy diagram to make my explanation more clear.

#134

I note that, though it’s far beyond the scope of this project, some day, in Source 2 or 3 or something, I’d like to see a remake of Half-Life where the maps are laid out in such a fashion that the astute player will determine that the rocket visited multiple times and finally launched at the end of On A Rail is the same one that was tested to kill the Tentacles at the end of Blast Pit.

#135

Be excited to keep up to date with this project. :slight_smile:

Hopefully it’s not as confusing as HL1’s OaR, but we’ll see how it goes. Because I loved BM’s OaR, but like others have said it was just too short and there wasn’t enough alien vs HECU encounters. Whereas I felt the HL1 OaR was either too long, or too confusing. I didn’t like how long it took to complete with such little end satisfaction. In fact it had me nearly fuming by the end of it.

I won’t get into how aliens are apparently meant to be winning and what not, that’s up to you to decide (personally I like them not winning until ST but that’s just me).

@Wangman - Are you helping him build it, or simply introducing all your thoughts and ideas? Either way it’s nice of you to put up points which we can potentially agree with.
@Everyone (I guess) - Try keep your opinions, uh, not so aggressive. We’re here to offer suggestions and help whilst Text kind of ‘decides’ what stays or goes. If you’re trying to be persuasive, attacking others isn’t always a good tactic.

#136

HOw about slope walls and pool of extremly highly electricuted warter under rails (like some areas in original HL), and slipery rails which would always make you fall down to that pool unless on tram ?

That would block player who would try to bypas your level and it would leave original feeling to It, with just hook blocking the tram.

#137

Some of the ideas that have been put forth using water are actually pretty good. Here’s how I’d do it:

You could theme the pre-office complex section as a partly flooded area of materials transport. The area surrounding the claw and shortly after it (including the track) could have a large electrified puddle that cannot be deactivated. After moving the claw obstacle, the player moves horizontally along the water-filled track then ramps upward a floor or 1/2-floor prior to reaching the office complex. This leaves the complex dry (consistent w/HL) while encouraging the player to stay on the tram for a longer stretch of time than a simple door would do. Again, the trick is to simply ENCOURAGE the player to stay on the tram because once they’re on, it’s unlikely they’ll get off until the appropriate time. The water puddle does this in a less obvious way than the door and allows you to potentially use the door in a later section of OaR should the need arise. You can only use the water here so you might as well grab it while it’s hot.

The other major advantage of this design is that it’s COMPLETELY consistent w/both HL’s A and B2, which is really what this section is based on and keeps w/the theme of electrified obstacles. It’s also consistent w/the power puzzle in BMS’ A and the pre-apprehension water section in C.

#138

Finished the screenshots for the original Half-Life On A Rail write up. Seen up there ^
Some of the actual text is still incomplete, but I will finish it later and post the game play videos as well.

One thing I realized while making this is that the entire rail system is actually very well thought out and really not at all confusing if you simply stay with your tram. Most of the track switches consist of you going in the same loop until you shoot the switch and then reach the next objective. The only way you could really mess this up is if you get off the tram and start running around in circles aimlessly.

You’re also generally going up throughout the chapter. There are several turntable tram lifts that you go up as well as track that is slanted upwards. Only towards the end of the chapter do you go down once slightly before reaching the outside.

There’s also basically no point in which the track ends for no reason. The entire rail system makes logical sense and is only split up so much because the HECU Marines have places encampments over parts of the rail which you eventually bypass and see the other sides of. This theme of following the original track continues all the way to the start of Apprehension. Much like following the road in the ST Uncut maps.

#139

I won’t write a standard long reply yet as I’ve had a really long, busy day and am about to conk out to bed for the next 14 hours.

However I will stop by to say two things.

Firstly, thanks a lot Jessiestorm for doing that write-up/walkthrough. While Wangman’s pitch bible is of course, extremely comprehensive and useful - this is a much simpler but exhaustive way of letting me “walkthrough” the levels to check certain things without having to fire up Half-Life every time I want to check something, which may save a lot of time in the long run. When I started ST Uncut (and still to this day) I use a program called Crafty “Object Viewer” by Nem to have the HL1 BSPs loaded and tourable through a camera, but it has a lot of downsides - the main one being it only renders basic world geometry. Thank you for taking your own time out to do what certainly must have been a lot of work. And thanks Wangman too, if I haven’t said it already, though I’m sure I have.

Secondly - and perhaps more excitingly, I’m planning (though not necessarily going to for certain) to release a video tomorrow, showcasing my current progress on C2A2A1 (I’ll explain the name a bit later). I’ve been working on it for 3 days (didn’t do anything yesterday) and I’ve already made a tremendous amount of progress - so much so that the A-B1 sections are actually nearly complete, in early form. I’m thoroughly pleased with how it’s all gone, and I think my redesign for the layout does a great job of reconciling HL1’s design philosophy with Black Mesa’s, but I guess that remains to be seen. With the recent influx of people keeping an eye on my work, given the fantastic publishing of my work in RPS and PCGamer, I’m hoping to just introduce people to what OaR Uncut will be all about, to clarify things a little bit, but also partly to show off what I’ve done so far, however prototypical it may be.

In terms of naming conventions, I’m now fairly certain that I’m now going to name my maps in terms of their positions relative to Black Mesa maps. This will make editing the level transitions much less confusing for me in the long run, and will make the level order much more apparent at a first glance to players. Remember this change won’t actually affect gameplay, it just makes my life a LOT easier in the editor, as I won’t have to rename Black Mesa’s maps.

“Old” naming convention:

BM_C2A2A - (BM Original)
BM_C2A2B
BM_C2A2C - (BM Original) Rocket Priming
BM_C2A2D
BM_C2A2E
BM_C2A2F - (BM Original) Rocket Launch

New “current” naming convention:
BM_C2A2A BM Original
BM_C2A2A1 - Mine
BM_C2A2B - BM Original
BM_C2A2B1 - Mine
BM_C2A2B2 - Mine
BM_C2A2C - BM Original

I’ll do a big write up tomorrow addressing some of the other stuff that’s come up in this thread’s discussion.

#140

Sounds good. Why aren’t you naming your first A map C2A2A1 though? This keeps w/how you labeled the B maps and it’s less confusing to say. Since the spotlight is on you, why not create an OaR ModDB page as well as well as a Youtube video? You can generate hype progressively as you work

Founded in 2004, Leakfree.org became one of the first online communities dedicated to Valve’s Source engine development. It is more famously known for the formation of Black Mesa: Source under the 'Leakfree Modification Team' handle in September 2004.