hundred millions of them
Uh-oh, this thread has taken a turn for the idiotic. Sperm is not guaranteed to become a baby, in fact its very unlikely. Fetuses, on the other hand, are guaranteed to become babies. They are the exact same thing in the same way a baby and an adult human are the exact same thing.
Actually, this thread took a turn for the worst when you tried to say fetuses were babies, and then changed it to they’re going to become babies, and as the thread goes on you argument is basically “devolving.”
Fetuses aren’t guaranteed to become babies. They’re not the same thing as a baby, they’re the exact same thing in the way that an egg is a chicken. An egg is NOT a chicken though. A fetus is NOT a human. It does not think, it does not feel, it does not… anything except feed and undergo growth, which is controlled at a purely cellular level absent of any glands controlling the process. Who cares what it’s going to be, it’s a separate object at that point in its life and cannot be called human. It’s far less human than a person in a coma, but people don’t seem to debate about taking 4 month coma patients off life support.
there are thousands of things that can prevent a zygote/foetus/whatever from becoming a baby dude
get your head out of your ass
and regardless of all that, the fact remains that anything that is growing inside the body of a woman and feeding directly off the woman and sometimes impairing the woman’s health is at the discretion of the woman to be removed
until the thing exits the woman’s body, it is part of the woman’s body, and nothing more than a tumour (up until the last 2 or 3 months or so), and so the woman has every right to remove it
Someonerandm so what you are saying in a different example with the same logic, if two people (female and male) are highly fertile, yet they do not have sex, it is immoral?
Im sorry but your logic and morals are flawed.
yes, fuck yes
as a male, he doesnt even have a valid opinion on female reproductive rights seeing as he DOESNT EVEN HAVE THE RIGHT SET OF GENITALS TO EVER BECOME PREGNANT
I’m not anti-abortion, and I’ve said that already. Learn to read. All I’m saying is that you are deluding yourselves that an abortion does not kill a human, because it does. From there, you can justify it.
You have yet to actually refute the argument that under your reasoning a baby is therefore also not a human. A baby is mentally equivalent to other animals, yet we consider them humans. Why? Because they will become humans, just like fetuses.
a baby has been born, therefore its a human. a fetus has not been born, therefore its not a human. it doesnt matter if its GOING to be a baby or not. i have the right to stop it from becoming one, because it’s not yet
and even if it is a human, ive still got the right to remove it from my body for as long as it directly depends on me and my body to survive.
Not all fetuses become human beings. And, like Fancy Pants said, they become human beings at the point of birth. Prior to birth, they are human life, but that doesn’t mean that abortion is the death of a human being.
Also, all human beings will become corpses eventually so having sex with any of them is having sex with a corpse. Right?
Birth is an absolutely arbitrary dividing line. A fetus has as much potential as a baby, since a baby has no ability to do anything of value, just like a fetus.
As to the corpse thing, really? Thats the best you can come up with? This is a question of whether something underdeveloped (like a baby) should be valued by its potential (as we do with babies) After development concludes it no longer applies.
We’ve established I agree with this.
its not arbitrary, its when you become physically independent, and when you become a human being.
and for the last time, a fetus is not a baby. when you’re born, you’re a baby. when you’re in the womb, you’re a fetus. really. it’s kinda the definition of fetus.
A baby is far from independent. Simply because it is not directly connected to the mother does not make it independent. Leave it alone and it will die.
As for the second part, no clue what you are referring to in that post.
Haven’t read much of this abortion debate so I’ll just jump in blindly with my opinion.
A death should not at all be measured in what is dying, whether it’s a cow a pig a blade of grass etc., it should only be weighed by the amount of suffering that death causes to the thing dying and those it/he/she affects. Generally when there is an abortion it is because the parents are not prepared to raise a child. If the parents can’t raise the child well, then that baby has bad odds at living a happy fulfilling life. Also, in addition to that, that baby would just be one more mouth for the world to feed, one more generator of trash, of CO2, one more waster of resources that can’t be brought back. Also, if the parents are unprepared that child would greatly strain them as well. Now the fetus itself at the legal stage of abortion probably can’t feel any pain or fear over an abortion, so it’s very unlikely the fetus itself suffers from the abortion.
you keep saying WELL ITS GONNA BE A BABY
too bad, its not one.
and yes thats why i said physically independent. a baby can live just fine without its biological mother, a fetus cannot.
Again, irrelevant. The point is its going to be a human. Babies are as useless as fetuses, but we consider them human. The same applies to fetuses.
Physically independent is an entirely meaningless concept. Someone is going to have to look after the baby for years after its birth, making the fact its physically independent mean nothing. Not to mention its not relevant to the debate at all.
your thinly veiled anti-choice rhetoric isnt cute
BUT THEYRE HUMAN!!! A FETUS IS THE SAME AS A BABY!!! is the main argument of anti-choice people, well done
Newborns are gross anyway so they shouldnt even be considered human.
Just because I use a valid point made by another group of people I disagree with does not make it invalid. I accept reality and draw different conclusions than them. Now logically refute my point.
I can tell you are running out of arguments, by the way.
no its not lol, when you become physically independent, WHEN YOU ARE BORN, is when you are a human being with rights.
and anti-choice people are never, ever right. you’re pretty much showing that you’re lying about being pro-choice when you say that.
and lol im not running out of arguments, you keep repeating the same shit that everyone has told you is wrong multiple times.
So, Someonerandm: Do you eat through a hole in your belly connected by a fleshtube to your mother?
Also, you’re allowed to have sex with infants because they’re going to be an adult eventually.