I believe everyone seems to have missed that last bit, so let me rephrase it:
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No ones complaining about it being scientifically inaccurate, they’re just showing off how big their brain penises are to each other.
You give people too much credit. I wasn’t generalising everyone at all. That would be beyond arrogant. It was just a little side comment for humour, actually, but it’s still completely true that the majority of people would have interpreted that sentence incorrectly. Believe me, I’ve had this discussion so many times. I’m only as full of myself as I’ve proven myself to be. Given that you don’t know me, I can completely understand how annoying and arrogant I can come across. That doesn’t dampen any validity of anything I’ve said though.
Whilst I’ll admit I didn’t take philosphy papers back when I was an undergrad (I would have if I’d had a free spot though), I’ve been actively involved in philosophical discussion since I was a young teenager. I’m not here to give you my life story, but I can assure, whilst I’m sure I could learn more in the field, I’m not ignorant when it comes to it.
Disagree. I could say the same to you, in fact. This isn’t a topic where you can be convinced from a couple of posts in the internet anyhow. If I knew you in real life, I’d be more than happy to properly discuss this.
The majority of the population are clueless and powerless. Physicists aren’t. That’s why we studied physics. It actually has answers.
Actually here’s one of the really frustrating things when it comes to philosophical discussion on this topic. You can’t actually have a philosophical discussion if you’re not aware of the science. Any opinions you may have on our powerlessness or lack of knowledge are meaningless if you don’t actually know what is known in that area.
It’s a life philosophy that I apply everyday. But it’s a different philosophy to taking everything to be uncertain.
Indeed, but if one were familiar with the concepts in this discussion, your view, catagorically, would not be as it is.
I’m not taking a dig at science fiction. How many times do I have to say that!!! I’m getting sick of repeating myself. I was making a point to the person who commented asking for the lack of correct physics to be pointed out while implying I didn’t know what I’m on about. I obliged to the request. That’s all.
I never have the intention of coming off as conceited or condescending. People who aren’t familiar with physics or just science in general (and jesus, not everyone has to be, and would never suggest otherwise) are usually the ones to feel like this, and often it’s because they feel belittled by the lack of relative knowledge in the subject. It’s usually more down to the self-security of the other person than it is the meaning behind the words I write/say.
It’s not hipocritical. They’re both very strong philosophies, but they are completely in agreement. My willingness to disregard everything I think I know in no way means I would not stake my life on what I know, and it certainly does not mean my I’d loose faith in my knowledge because someone who hasn’t learnt the subject in question emplores that they have a better philosophy on science. What bullshit. (That wasn’t personal). Taking the philiosophy that nothing is ever certain just seems depressing and is a very primitive way of thinking.
I admit, I have a pretty big ego. But I do keep it in check. And, again, if you knew me, or knew people who knew me, you’d know that my ego is only proportional to my understanding of a topic, as anyone’s should be.
Massive tangent. Go back a couple of pages and you’ll see how it started.
I think you mean “experiments” where you’ve said “experience”? Just wanted to clarify that for the sake of clarity. And thank you. Pretty much in mutual agreement. I also laughed at your examples, especially the YouTube one. I’ve literally heard EXACTLY those from people before.
You missed the point. And it’s also quite the opposite of stupid - intellectual.
Lol. Pretty much.
Yes, of course, it was “experiment”, my lame english betrayed me…
I think this isn’t totally unrelated to half-life, though, as the half-life and portal series have a relation to science that is unique in the video game industry (except perhaps bioshock, didn’t play it so i can’t tell). The Half-Life and Portal series are the most sciency games ever!
You don’t give them enough credit, or you simply haven’t met that many people.
So because I haven’t studied science at a university I cannot discuss our own insignificance in the universe? Because if I don’t have an education on the subject my mind is automatically unable to grasp the concept?
Who are you to say that? You do realise that equates to ‘if you don’t agree then your not right, like I am’.
You’ve failed, majorly.
Who are you to say THAT? Lol. Personally I think it is MORE primitive create a God complex around yourself due to your own believed superiority. Read a history book, civilization has been full of them. Arrogance beyond words.
As someone else has pointed out…
This is stupid.
I think it’s pretty well known that Eli took an arrow in the knee…
I used to be optimistic as well, but then i figured a sequence of “who wants to be a millionnaire” (the french equivalent to be exact) when, to the question “what revolves around the earth”, the majority of the spectators answered “the sun”. It gave me a shock.
You shouldn’t mix up “insignificance” and “clueness”. That’s not the same at all! I’m quite sure scientists in their majority (and perhaps especially astrophysicists like blueshot) would agree that we, humans, represent nothing compared to the universe… But we are not totally clueless. We have the scientific method to try and understand this mess nature seems to be at first. And, look around you, it works!
1)I think you distort what he wanted to say here…
2)Hell, that’s the principle of all debate: “I think you’re wrong, so i argue to convince you”. What’s the deal?
Jeez, don’t be so agressive… This is getting ridiculous. Also, i kind of agree with the opinion that the “nothing is ever certain and that’s all” philosophy doesn’t lead anywhere. Because let’s face it, it’s true in theory but it implies we should just call it quits and do nothing: “oh this looks too complex, i give up before i even tried”.
I like this Blushot69 guy.
Maybe the majority are intelligent relative to you then.
That is hilarious and a brilliant example of what I’m talking about.
When was our significance in the universe the topic of conversation? You’re either not reading thoroughly or intentionally adding meaning that isn’t there in order to feel that you have a point.
You’re clearly confused so I’ll clarify what I was saying for you. You can’t judge the certainty of any science without knowing that science. Or its significance for that matter. That’s what I was saying. Nothing more. Please respond to what I’m saying, not what you would like to think I’m saying.
In fact, look at this post you made on a different thread
See how it can be frustrating and wrong for people to comment in a discussion when they haven’t learnt about the topic? This is obviously on a much smaller scale, but it’s the same concept.
Exactly.
Could it be because I’ve gone through the process myself and have also gone through it with other people and seen others beyond that, that I might have something to say on the matter? I’m literally qualified to be able to say it.
There is a big difference between not intending for something to happen and intending for something to not happen. I would have needed to be doing the latter to have “failed”, however the former is the case. If you feeled belittled, it’s because you’re out of your depth. That says far more about you than it does about me.
Again, experience means I can say that. I’m happy to disagree on what’s more primitive. I don’t have a God complex and I don’t class myself as a superior being. That’s ludacris. I am, however, well aware when my knowledge on something is superior (same goes for when it’s inferior) to someone else’s. You’re just trying to throw insults and have completely gone off the topic of conversation. I admit I can be arrogant, but that doesn’t make anything I have to say less correct or relevant. If it upsets you that I’m confident in what I know, I really don’t care; that’s your problem.
Yep, agreed.
Yet you don’t mean to come of as arrogant?
No. My main point was that overall our perception of the universe could be incorrect, and thus our understanding through experimentations on what we as a whole perceive could be entirely wrong. I’m not saying it is, I’m not poopooing what you’ve been taught or the education you’ve recieved. I’m merely stating a fact you literally cannot accept because of your own percieved intellectual worth, and the importance said worth has on your mental well being, in this case your need to be right.
It’s something I was taught by someone with a degree in philisophy, so because you haven’t been taught it you can’t comment.
( Annoying, no? )
There is nothing I don’t understand about any of your arguments, nothing. Just because I brought up a point which you believe attacks your intellectual worth you immidiately assume I don’t understand. It’s shocking really.
So because you’ve gone through the process and you’ve met others who’ve gone through the exact same thing (wow, people on your course agree with you, what a shock. ) you know ( and to an extent demand ) what I should think?
No, the reason I feel belittled is due to your belitting comments. I thought that would of been obvious. The fact you can type shit like that says far more about you than it does about me.
Also, if it’s not your intention of coming across as arrogant, you can still fail at your intended intentions, regardless of specificity.
Also again. Just because I take the view that nothing is ever certain, as it clearly isn’t, doesn’t mean I have to live my life bound to that idea, I just accept the possibility. You immidiately assume because I believe this I must be an anti-progressive neanderthal, which is just pathetic, and yet another nod towards your generalising mentality.
The rules of relativity themselves seemingly break down when interacting with black holes. Black holes themselves evaporate over time, leaving the matter they accumulate where? Dark matter, believed to be 3 or 4/5ths of all matter in the universe is beyond our understanding. Read up about the Quantum Zeno effect. Etc. Etc.
Yet your trying to tell me that we know so much about the universe? That everything we find from now on is certain based on theories coming up to a hundred years old? Read up on science history and I’m sure you’l find many times where our commonly accepted scientific knowledge becomes ever more complex and layered, or downright destroyed with a new discovery centuries down the road.
I’m extremely bored now, so please, no more.
Thats pathetic and extremely narrow minded. Especially in regards to how it’s worded.
There is no truth without evidence.
Is there anyone reading the discussion but them??
Now, do you agree that this assertion is similar to this one: “The screen I am looking at could be just an utter illusion and could actually not exist”?
If no, then you are not coherent.
If yes, then your main point is a triviality.
Everyone here accept this possibility, but I am pretty sure you don’t give it as probability or credit as me or blushot. That’s why the assertion “our understanding could be entirely wrong” is either a bit arrogant or a triviality.
Because, if you do think there is a appreciable probability that our understanding is completely wrong, then you must be fully aware of what you are calling into question, you must have studied science, or it will just be bar talk.
Otherwise, you could as well say there is a tiny chance for our universe to be ruled by an invisible-undetectable pink unicorn with superpowers. Yep, true. Cool.
I can’t help but comment what follows. Blushot will certainly do it better than me, though.
You know, if you want to come up with a phenomenon that general relativity alone is unable to explain, there’s no need to take a black hole. For instance, general relativity can’t explain why you are not going through your chair right now.
What do you mean by “Dark matter is beyond our understanding”?
If it is: “we don’t know what it is exactly yet”, then okay. So what?
If it is: “we will never be able to understand it”, then it is irrationnal and ridiculous.
Seems to be another weird quantum phenomenon. I fail to see how it is related to the discussion.
I wonder if you are aware that, when a scientist says something has been proved, most of the time it does not mean it has been proved theoretically, but by experiment! I am starting to think that some philosophers, when speaking about science, have the tendency to focus on theories and disregard experiment… That’s what Feynman said, anyway.
I don’t get it.
I stopped reading it a while ago, because tl;dr.
Come on guys, it’s a GAME.
Talk about thread revival.
I want a fucking reason for this.
He didn’t ask 
What the fuck is going on here? Who summoned this miserable thread?