Taxes?

I debated with myself for quite some time before posting this topic because of the potential for flaming. However, I fully believe that if we can be mature about this subject, someone may learn something from someone else. Let’s hope we can be mature about this. I’ll try not to tread on anyone at least starting out. I am approaching this from the point of view of someone living in the United States so I’m going to be Americentric here. I apologize to non-Americans.

So, there’s this common belief in the United States (not sure how it is in other parts of the world) that “taxes” are “evil” and a barrier to economic growth. This notion leads to people believing that being taxed is somehow punishment and if someone on the higher end of the income spectrum is taxed at a higher rate, they are being “punished for success”.

I don’t believe that at all. They aren’t being punished for anything.

They will claim that, through “hard work” and “perseverance”, that they became successful by themselves with “no help” from anyone-- especially not those in government.

To me, everyone that is a “success”, at least in the United States, did it not only through their hard work, but through the hard work of others. Bill Gates would not be the “success” that he is without the hard work of all the people employed at Microsoft (I use him only as an example). I submit that NO ONE becomes a “success” all by themselves. They heavily rely on government.

Because of this, I fully believe that, if you rely so much on a government system and benefit substantially, you should pay for it.

This leads me to the “involuntary” claim that many make: That government is “taking your money” at the “point of a gun”. What they mean by this is, if you don’t pay your taxes, the government will send people to your house with guns to force the money out of your pocket. Not only do I find this extremely inane, its implications are sorely lacking in reality. Yes, if you refuse to pay taxes, there will be law enforcement at your door. That much is true. What isn’t true, however, is that they’re there to ‘steal’ your money (as many claim).

I use a grocery store as an analogy. If you go into a grocery store and begin eating the produce…and refuse to pay for what you’re consuming, law enforcement will be there to “force the money out of your pocket”. I can already hear the response: “I don’t have to go into that store” and this is absolutely true. But if you ARE in the store and consume things, you must pay.

Simply living in the United States (or any other civilized nation) consumes government resources. From Bill Gates down to the homeless vagrant on the street; they all consume government resources just for simply existing in the United States.

And there are those that don’t want to pay for what they consume by continuing to benefit from a civilized society. I never begrudge a single penny that leaves my pocket in the form of taxes. I will, however, begrudge what that money is used for.

I’d love to hear other people’s take on taxes.

Thanks! :slight_smile:

The goal is to achieve a wealth so hefty, that you could care less how much you’re taxed.

Let me start off by saying that I’m very liberal, but also very independent. I don’t think that there’s anything inherently wrong with our party system, but rather with the some of the politicians in them who take the party divisions waaaay to seriously and aren’t willing to cooperate with the other side. /rant, /offtopic

I think that Norway and Sweden have it right (not sure about finlandlandia - samzala?) with their taxes. Very high taxes, but free healthcare and lots of other stuff. Quality of living there is extremely high, etc. In that sense I support higher taxes.

With that said, I don’t want higher taxes simply because the government has an extremely unbalanced budget. Many Americans simply can’t afford to pay higher taxes unless they relieve another expense - like healthcare. I think I’ve stated my opinions about healthcare in the past here… :retard:

So basically I don’t mind higher taxes as long as I benefit from them, in fact I’d rather have higher taxes (preferably a unified tax) as long as I get more benefits.

fucking lol. First, nobody ever learns anything on the internet, because nobody will ever admit to being wrong. Second, it’s impossible to have a “mature” discussion about taxes, because people who are anti-Tax on principle (I’m biting my tongue with respect to descriptive adjectives) hold their beliefs to be religiously self-evident. It’s no different than having a “mature discussion” with a Christian about whether or not Jesus was a deity.

I personally see no reason to complain about taxes, mainly because I get benefits from the government. Healthcare is cheap and available for everyone, public transportation is cheap and available to everyone. A lot of state-controlled services are cheap and available to everyone. The country takes care of me, so I see no issues with paying them their wage, just like how my company pays my wage.

I also don’t care what happens with “my” tax money after I’ve paid taxes. The moment I paid taxes, it’s not my money anymore, and the government can do whatever it wants with it.

People who complain about taxes only see the government taking their money. If I had it my way I’d make all citizens of a taxed country play SimCity 4 so they could see exactly why taxes exist. You want the government to build roads and a new police station? Then give them some damn money so they can actually do it. Not happy about where your taxes are being spent? Tough shit, the government decides what is more important to work on in society. You don’t like those decisions then VOTE against it. Don’t like that system? Then go set up your own bloody country or start a revolution.

These are the people you want to have a “mature discussion” with.

taxes suck.

No need to thank me[/SIZE]

A government-free state (AKA ‘failed state’) would suck a whole helluva lot more.

to be serious I don’t agree with my government’s economic policy. They sold out every possible mine and factory. They didn’t build anything useful. and when the government had nothing to get money from, they started raising the tax levels. They have been very spendthrift. We have lots of problems. I wonder how this is going to end.

Edit: sorry for my bad english I am still trying to improve it at the college, I hope you can understand me.

I totally agree that its necessary for people to be taxed, But that doesn’t mean i cant bitch about it. Barely scraping by as it is

Income and property taxes are complete bullshit.

That is all.

Enjoy your unpaved roads.

Enjoy being taxed on land you own and having your income taken away.

Oh, looks like you are enjoying it.

Especially inheritance tax, that is a load of bull.

I don’t know why the United States needs to tax it’s citizens anymore. They already print out billions upon billions for their own purposes, what do they need our money for anymore?

Country will fall sooner or later anyway though.

Enjoy your tattered bills and roadside muggings.

If they print more billls, then the value of each one decreases as there are more to go around. Think about it mate.

Apparently you misunderstood.

Did you know the United States is in the midst of a recession? Did you know the government conjured up 700 billion+ last fall to hand out? Connect the dots.

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