My Vision of Black Mesa/Half-Life Series

Have you ever heard the phrase, “Semantics is the last bastion of those who seek to win an argument that is already lost.” ?

Of course you haven’t, I made it up. But it’s pretty good, huh?

Call them what you like then: “problems to be solved before one can advance”, etc it doesn’t matter.

You don’t want to solve those puzzles (or whatever you prefer to call them), you want the game makers to give you the solution. When a player repeats the same solution without success expecting a different result, it’s not a flaw in the game design.

On a side note, I thought you said you were a HL veteran?

Cut scenes are not modern and they’re not an enhancement. Half Life was notable for conveying narrative through gameplay, rather than using cut scenes to relay the story. Half Life’s integration of narrative is the modern innovation, replacing cut scenes, which are the old, clunky story-telling devices. Cut scenes are neither innovative nor modern. You’ve got it backward.

Only if EA makes HL3.

I think your comment here pretty much sums up your positions on ‘modernizing’. So, no, I don’t think there’s any miscommunication.

Like I said, some people don’t understand Half Life or why those games are great.

You don’t know that, why do you think there’s no EP3 and it’s more than likely going to be HL3 and it’s still not out?
In order to stay relevant, adaptation and innovation are needed. If EP3 has played the same as the previous episodes, it would only harm the series for being half-a-decade behind

Casual games are the future, you would be surprised how people aren’t capable of solving a simple task even if the games tell that in an indication window on screen, like what to do, where to go and what button to press.
Portal 2 puzzles were “dumbed down” but other than that it’s the better game in comparison to the first one.
Valve isn’t stupid, even they know this…

But since this one is a fan-made free mod, it’s getting kinda offtopic and might be irrelevant.
All I’m saying that some more obvious and modern things wouldn’t hurt the game… maybe for some “purists” that were raging due to an optional to use and optional to choose Python zoom

Again though, how are cut scenes innovative? How do they bring the game up to modern standards? How does the game suffer from in game narrative? In what way are cut scenes better than in environment storytelling?

Problem solving, immersion, and integrated narrative aren’t indicative of antiquated games, they’re indicative of quality games. Putting a player into an environment to shoot at bad guys, and throwing in some cut scenes to explain why he’s there and why he’s shooting the bad guys, isn’t indicative of modern games, it’s indicative of lower-quality games.

Cut scene narrative isn’t new, innovative, or retro-chic.

You’re not talking about zoom, you’re talking about removing problem solving and adding cut scenes.

OK - so HL3 is going to be an EA shooting gallery?

EA were working on a Half-Life related project before, so who knows.

I don’t think there’s more to say to this as our opinions differ, so it’s going back and forth.
We should give some space to others to state their opinion or move/lock this thread as I was already being told it doesn’t belong into a BlackMesa and it’s getting offtopic.
But a reply from a dev would be nice though

You want your thread closed?

According to the justification of others, proceed with your own judgement.
If you think this thread still has a purpose and it’s not against the rules, then keep it.

It’s not like I have more to say when mostly it’s just a one big “NO”
There has been some dramatization over my post IMO, please do not doubt my Half-Life fandom.
I know what makes the series special, that’s why I’m waiting a day after day for a sequel.

I don’t want the gameplay or immersion dumbed-down, just more user-friendly and less depressing… it’s possible.
Again, reconsider it… would a short G-man cutscene or some more HECU scripted dialogue or a single camera-scene angle destroy the game?

You want to add this scripted dialog to have a puzzle solved for you. Your problem with that puzzle isn’t a dev-side issue, it’s a player-side issue. BTW, that puzzle, with the garg, has the same solution as in HL, so you shouldn’t have had a problem.

The other 2 ideas break immersion and aren’t necessary anyway.

yes

I went into playing Black Mesa expecting nothing but the best.

What did I get? Better than that.

The modification as a whole is an experience that shatters most AAA game titles that I’ve played. I’m not switching characters between ‘missions’ as I try to ‘kill the bad guys’, I’m not sitting back and watching the cutscenes roll by so that I can understand how the story is supposed to progress. I AM the player, progressing through a CONSTANTLY unfolding plot, I am ALWAYS immersed with the game, which is more then I can say about the Call of Battlefield: Honorfare series.

I do not believe there is anything flawed about the game, DoTard, [COLOR=‘Red’]<edit - no insults please>

Okay then, and seriously, you can disagree without throwing insults at me.[COLOR=‘Red’]<edit - said as if you didn’t say exactly the same thing to someone else>
I have finished the game 3 times already, loved it each time. But I know people that left mid-game for some of the mentioned reasons among others.

This mod is getting a very positive reception, nine of ten people love it, but bet that half of them are a long-time fans.

I find it funny that people scold those who give some criticism.

@Johnyo, funny.

Some people prefer Candyland or the My Little Pony board game to Go or Chess, but that doesn’t mean that Go or Chess should be changed to please those people.

Expressing a different perspective is neither scolding nor trolling. You should expect that others may have a different opinion or perspective, and be prepared to defend your ideas. If you find that you can’t defend them, you may have to consider the possibility that perhaps they’re not good ideas.

Absence of cut-scenes is one of the reasons why I like this game - it allows me to “integrate” into the world of game completely. If I’d like not to participate in the story, but watch one for the most of the time, I’d go to the cinema…

Also, I’m not a huge Half-Life fan overall, yet I found the puzzles to be interesting and challenging, and this is despite the fact that I don’t play FPS games at all except for this one. You can easily imagine how frustrated I was at the beginning while getting familiar with the basic mechanics… I even had problems with shooting :slight_smile:

But all these things you’re talking about, señor Dotard, never forced me to stop playing in the middle, on the contrary, I was interested in mastering the game rather than quitting it unfinished :slight_smile:

I don’t know, maybe it’s different for everyone, but my experience was complete the way it is and doesn’t require enhancement :slight_smile:

I’m not trying to be mean, but those people shouldn’t be playing half-life then.

But that’s the thing, it’s not “criticism”, you simply want HL to be something it isn’t.

wow, it sounds like you really have enjoyed this game despite your inexperience… good for you sir :slight_smile:

Well said.

Not entirely, maybe I’m just not that hardcore.
As long as there’s a crowbar, mute Gordon and aliens to smash, I call it Half-life. Environmental puzzles =/= puzzling environments.

No cut scenes. it is the antithesis of the half life experience. for cut scenes just play GTA or BF/COD

https://www.valvesoftware.com/games/hl2.html

I think your vision on this game is a little corrupted.

Again, I am curious as to whether or not you actually remember anything about the half-life series, because every single game in the franchise has had puzzles, simple and confusing. The puzzles ramp up in dificulty as you progress, the same way new enemies are introduced and battles become more challenging as you progress.

One of the reasons Half-Life games are so well regarded is that they let the player figure out things on his/her own, a cutscene to help you out would do the exact opposite.

It’s the same reason Valve didn’t want to have human characters you travel with just drop obvious hints to make those puzzles easy.

This old thing is a pretty good explanation as to why it works so well, and if you forgot about it (or haven’t watched it) will maybe remind you why Valve does the complete opposite of what you are suggesting, and why those changes wouldn’t be added to BM.

I don’t even get what this means. It almost sounds like you want them to replace environmental puzzles with confusing level design?

@ Dotard: If cutscenes in HL are your thing, you might like the mod I’m working on. There will be at least a few, mostly to ease the transition between maps in a manner similar to map transitions in “Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker.” I always found suddenly being ambushed by a LOADING marker to be somewhat jarring as it is, and considering the maps will be designed to be back-trackable and multiple-use areas that keep track of variables between maps as in a Metroidvania, cutscene content is slightly more appropriate. However, using point_viewcontrol cutscenes can sometimes bug the interface, and interrupting the maps mid-mission to show off scripted events is unlikely as it breaks flow. (For cutscenes, I’ll put the player’s actual model in a darkbox outside the map with a button around them to press, and a HUD hint to hit “USE” to skip)

The only reason I’d use camera cuts is to direct the player if I have a complex puzzle, as in the original Metroid Prime. But again, it’s unlikely I’ll do much in the way of cutscene content aside from level transitions and possibly the beginning and end of the mod as visual rewards. A lot of people hate cutscenes with a passion- they take away control from the player to show something. I happen to like them in some cases, as in the aforementioned “Metal Gear” series because they have very tight camerawork and excellent actor blocking, and a good sense of style that is appropriate to the series. But over-use of cutscenes (as in MGS4) can just get annoying. MGS4’s last three acts are heavily out-balanced in the cutscene to gameplay ratio, as well as major changes to the first two acts’ gameplay ideas making things more annoying(sneaking through warzones in Act 1 and 2, Act 3 is following people and a remake of the MGS3 motorcycle chase, Act 4 is a nostalgia level against robots, Act 5 everyone knows you’re there already so the whole map is hunting you).

In Half Life 2 and their episodes, the visual rewards of cutscenes are retained, but in “Vistas” - areas of major scenery porn for the player to take in while retaining full control. Story sequences are also blocked out for NPCs with scripts. If the player wants to look someplace else or throw things around the room rather then watch the story content, they can, and that’s why HL is refreshingly different than most shooters and so highly regarded among gamers.

Either way, as far as vanilla HL2 goes, it’s always been about a fluid, continuous journey, and interrupting gameplay to show off scripted events breaks flow. Think about HL2 Episode One- in the commentary, one of the level designers specifically made an area of buildings to frame soldiers rappelling down in front of the player. It’s a lot more impressive than cutting to them with a seperate cut-scene.

Or the area where you come upon the citadel in the distance of the destroyed city, where all the wires and destruction is placed in a way to direct the player’s attention to the fact that the Citadel is still standing, and towers over the destruction of City 17 - but the player can choose to completely ignore it if he wants. Having a cutscene that directs the player’s attention to the citadel hurts the subtle narrative in moments like that because it’s no longer subtle.

Founded in 2004, Leakfree.org became one of the first online communities dedicated to Valve’s Source engine development. It is more famously known for the formation of Black Mesa: Source under the 'Leakfree Modification Team' handle in September 2004.