c1a3a - unclimbable ladder

Black Mesa Archive In-game Issues
#1

Hello! I am big into finding secrets and whatnot, and I have found a ladder which I am able to jump right into yet Gordon will not grab hold of it. It is in the c1a3a elevator shaft near the two standing turrets placed in water.
Getpos information: setpos -413.822083 -1127.505737 -255.968750;setang 8.393 - When I took this information, I was able to run straight forward without even jumping and fall right into the ladder.
Maybe you can make it grabbable, then break it off a little higher up and put a secret at the bottom? Screenshots enclosed.

Before and after the jump:

#2

To be blunt, the secret at the bottom is supposed to be that this shaft kills you if you slip into it.

#3

I’m not sure what your comment has to do with the bug, and I find it obstructive and smarmy.

This is a map design bug. The level designers probably didn’t think the player would be able to jump and reach the ladder, which is why they didn’t set it as a ladder in the Hammer Editor, thus leaving it treated as a wall, resulting in Gordon not grabbing a ladder that he is literally leaning up against with a 0 unit separation.

The most expedient fix might be breaking the ladder a little ways up the shaft, making it useable, and putting an item in the bottom of the shaft, or just leaving the shaft as is. The shaft could also be made deep enough that a 100/100 player will always die after hitting the bottom of it, thereby removing the need for a “Kill” trigger at the bottom of the shaft (if there is one).

Can you please tell me why Gordon won’t grab the ladder, Sage J. Fox? Do you not consider this a bug?

#4

First of all, you’re taking my comment way too seriously.

You can’t grab the ladder because you’re not supposed to. That part of the map is a hazard puzzle. You have to figure out how to get across the slippery floor without falling down the open elevator shaft, and ideally without setting off the sentry trip lines. You can’t grab onto the ladder because it’s just there for detail, there would be no point to there being, or even act against the point of the shaft if there was, a useable ladder there.

So no, I don’t think it’s a bug.

#5

“You can’t grab the ladder because you’re not supposed to.” - I believe you can’t grab the ladder because the developers didn’t think the player could get to it, and so didn’t define it as a ladder in order to save resources.

“That part of the map is a hazard puzzle.” - The ladder itself is not a hazard puzzle. The hazard puzzle is made up of the hallway and the elevator shaft. I understand that the elevator shaft is intended to kill the player if they slip off the edge. However, if they slip off the edge the ladder sure as heck isn’t going to save them, because it is not reachable in that way. The ladder is only reachable by someone who carefully positions himself along the ledge, then aims right at the ladder and jumps/falls toward it (I failed 3x in a row when trying carefully to reach it).

“You have to figure out how to get across the slippery floor without falling down the open elevator shaft, and ideally without setting off the sentry trip lines.” - I agree.

“You can’t grab onto the ladder because it’s just there for detail,” - It is there for detail because I believe the level designer didn’t think the player would be able to reach it.

“there would be no point to there being, or even act against the point of the shaft if there was, a useable ladder there.” - I believe instead of “or even” you wanted an “and would even”. My apologies if English is not your first language. Anyhow, this is completely wrong. Look at the first screenshot. The ladder is tucked away in the corner, and is far away and 90 degrees-to the direction the player would be falling after slipping off the edge under normal use. Under normal circumstances, no one is going to touch that ladder after slipping off the edge in an organic fashion. Therefore, saying there is no point in having a usable ladder there is false, because it would not save someone who fell organically, and would therefore not defeat the purpose of the hazard trap.

This is, by the way, the only ladder I have encountered in the entire game (and in that I’ll include Opposing Force, Blue Shift, HL2 + ep1 + ep2) that I can reach but not use that is not visibly damaged. All other ladders that aren’t meant to be climbed are not reachable, or are damaged, or are climbable only to a certain point at which the ladder becomes damaged. This is the main reason I think this is a map design bug.

I have attempted to illustrate where you and I disagree, and why I feel how I do. Ultimately, it’s up to the Devs to decide if it’s a bug or not. I don’t want you to comment in any more of my threads because I think you insist on being right even when you are obviously wrong. Please stay away from me on these forums, and I will stay away from you.

#6

Whoa…calm down. An attitude like that won’t get you very far in these forums.

#7

In my defense, I feel my attitude is a logical one, and the best one to use when in bug-squashing mode. I found and documented a bug. I was told it was not a bug by someone who phrased an illogical and condescending argument, so I told him where he went wrong and then asked him not to talk to me anymore. I understand that on internet forums everyone wants to be able to say anything to anyone at any time, but sometimes for harmony’s sake people should stay away from each other. I don’t want him making insulting and inaccurate posts in my thread.

Believe it or not, I have a right to be spoken to as an adult, and to determine when I no longer want someone to talk to me. If this forum feels otherwise, then I will leave.

#8

Please.
It’s still founded in reason. The developers clearly didn’t expect the player to be able to reach it, so they didn’t give it the appropriate entities. Worth addressing, but not worth crying about.

#9

Take your brainless comments somewhere else, please. With such low-effort and obnoxious posting, no wonder you have 3,377 posts and only 165 likes. That’s one like per 20 posts. It seems most people don’t value what you have to say very much; count me among them.

#10

Yeah, this thread has gotten too heated. Thanks for the report and if the devs wish to address it, they will. In the meanwhile, I’m locking this thread.

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