On A Rail Uncut - Re-Adding Cut Areas/Scenes (Expansion Project)

General Development Source 1
#661

Wowzers!

Let me just say that I am very very impressed with all the stuff I have seen so far. I actually discovered both this and Surface Tension uncut today (and I haven’t gotten the chance to play Surface Tension uncut yet as a result), but I am really excited for it. I’m been peeking through this thread a little bit so far as well, it’s pretty neat to see how this is going along!

Needless to say, I am really looking forward to the release of this mod.

Since we’re on the subject of these two rooms, I’d like to give a couple cents here.

I am also sold on the idea of a black-out ambush. That is a really great idea. I’m also sold on the incorporating the room into the actual route. I didn’t really enjoy this area in the original half-life partly because of the reason (the other being the bunker gun, I hated those).

That said, I do have some reservations about seeing a QE-level ambush though. From what I’m reading, it would be as difficult as QE. The thing about that particular scene was not only did you have the music playing for it (which I admit would not be a problem here if you managed to find a tune), but there was just more reward for surviving it (ala the scientist being in awe at your accomplishment).

EDIT: Although then again you are much more equipped during this chapter than in Questionable Ethics. I would have to see…

#662

Good news everyone!

I think I’ll be alright to post the alpha this evening. I got a fair amount done yesterday and I think I’ll be able to get it all finished for this evening. Expect it to be rough, however. It’s an alpha, that’s the nature of alphas. Feel free to give me copious feedback as you have done in the past, or simply point out major issues, however you see fit.

Bear in mind (and I have said this a few times now) I am planning on doing FAR LESS test versions than I did with ST Uncut, and this is for 2 main reasons. Firstly, I feel the quality of this product is starting at a much higher level than ST Uncut was, partly because I’ve had much stronger community feedback from the onset, and also partly because the experience of ST Uncut has improved my mapping and thought process a lot. For example - clipping issues turned out to be a very major issue during ST Uncut, and I spent many versions just fixing those vast numbers of problems. Sometimes I’d have to redesign entire areas or layouts just to fix clipping problems due to the nature of model based work. Since I started OaR Uncut, I have generally now been very, very conscientious of clipping problems, and as a result I don’t think I’ll have to redesign entire areas for the purposes of fighting clipping, nor will there be clipping issues throughout every test version. Hopefully. This applies to other areas of mapping too.

The second reason, is that I’m well into my final university term now, I simply don’t have the time to engage in such a lengthy testing process this time around, nor do I want this project “hanging over my head,” so to speak. I will try not to let quality suffer, but I want to get this project done. As a result, this is my road map for test versions:

-A maps Alpha - This evening
-B maps Alpha - 2 - 4 weeks time
-OaR Uncut Full Beta - TBD
-OaR Uncut Full Beta II (maybe, maybe not - depends)
-OaR Uncut Full Release Candidate - TBD
-OaR Uncut Full Release - TBD

Bam. Simple. I’ll see you guys this evening, hopefully.

#663

Not gonna depend on it! :wink:

We can post whatever detail is wrong aswell, cause it’s an alpha? :slight_smile:

#664

Yeah, feel free to comment on whatever you feel like.

However, it might be worth noting that very small problems may be ignored in favour of larger issues, as this is very early on in the development cycle.

#665

I take it that for now the alphas won’t be integrated into the BM campaign?

#666

They are integrated - flawlessly as far as I can tell.

#667

Good!

Well really looking forward to this first release :slight_smile:

Played the complete Black Mesa OaR Chapter again yesterday

#668

Yeah! Can’t wait.

#669

Stupid question. Will the alpha be plugged into the main campaign of BM, or will it just be a separate series of maps?

#670
#671

Right guys, it’s either coming in 3 - 4 hours or so, or tomorrow afternoon at the latest. I’ve done the biggest bit of work - the Cafeteria overhaul, and it’s looking pretty damn good now, actually - very glad I decided to do it. I’m pretty happy with this one, but we’ll see how everyone reacts. I’m currently darkening up the map - removing lights here and there, giving it a bit more mood.

Currently the biggest thing to do I have left is the reactive scripts which I haven’t set up properly yet. The map only works properly if you play it from one side to the other currently. I’m working on setting up the scripting so it plays differently if you enter the office complex from the cafeteria side.

The biggest problem that’s going to be present in the alpha is optimization. It really, REALLY isn’t well optimized. I will focus on optimization for the beta.

#672

Don’t make it too dark, but sounds good.
As long as there’s nothing game breaking about it hopefully having it integrated from the start won’t cause any problems.
(Or what am I saying, you’ve tested it enough so far)

#673

Yeah, don’t make it look like DooM3, but more like Quake 4 :wink:

#674

I’m almost done but unfortunately I’ve run into a pretty serious bug which will probably hamper my progress a lot.

I’ve basically finished up everything I wanted to get done on A1 and A2, but sadly, with entdata on A2 now hitting 220%, weird things are starting to happen. I’m pretty sure that 220% entdata is some kind of world record - but the annoying thing is - I’ve actually been as careful as possible to reduce the number of entities. The problem is that almost every non-brush counts as an entity. There are over 150 paths on the tram’s track alone, which would already account for a very large number of entities.

I’m a little stymied here. I seriously don’t want to have to start deleting entities, but it looks like it might be necessary.

The only weird behavior I’m getting so far is that stuff which is supposed to gib, isn’t gibbing properly. It’s a pretty serious bug. Crates, when broken, mysteriously disappear, rather than breaking into pieces. Corpses subjected to explosions don’t actually gib, they just keep flapping around. I actually don’t know what’s causing it and it only recently started happening, but I’m fairly confident it’s the absurdly high entdata.

I’ll keep you guys posted, I’m not sure whether I’ll hold off the release until I can solve it or not. For all I know it could just be on my end, but I just don’t know. I doubt it though.

#675

It’s an alpha, and in alphas we can live with that :slight_smile:

#676

Well, at least the gib system knows when to cut down on stuff, rather than eating up all the remaining free edicts and crashing the game. :stuck_out_tongue:

#677

It’s entirely plausible you may need to cut the map into additional sections. A shame too. It’s either that or remove more clutter/some entities.

#678

I’m almost positive that’s what it is. I think I remember a dev stating the reason some boxes don’t drop junk when they break is because the entdata is too high already, and Ram stating that they had to remove a bunch of shit 'cause they kept going over budget.

#679

Yeah, most likely.

It’s a big shame, because the maps are actually ready. I’m very pleased with how they’ve gone everywhere else. But I want to fix this bug before I ship them out for alpha.

Thus, you’ll have to wait till Monday evening earliest, guys, sorry. I really thought I could do it for this evening, and I would have done if not for this bug. I seriously cannot map tomorrow evening as I haven’t even started to prepare for my big presentation on Monday yet - so I really need to do proper work tomorrow. I’m sure you can handle the wait a little bit longer. It’s all looking very good, aside from this stupid bug.

I call it a bug, but it’s more of an engine limitation. Sadly, I almost certainly don’t have a way around it other than deleting stuff, which is seriously infuriating. My initial thought was, as Chickenprotector suggested - to move the level transition a bit further into the A2 map so that some of the A2 map will then be on the A1 map instead (which is well within budget). The problem with this is that there’s simply absolutely nowhere else good to put the level transition. It’s currently in the best place by absolutely miles. Moving it down to just after the 50 Cal section wouldn’t help very much at all, at most that would cut out 5 - 10% of the entities. Moving it anywhere beyond there means a level transition during the office complex, which is seriously bad. Though a transition in the office complex DID exist in HL1, it wouldn’t work well in Source as the loading times are way higher - and you have to cross the level boundary three times - once to deactivate the security - once to backtrack to the tram - and once more to get to the end of the level. Not ideal.

You see the problem.

#680

Well I’d hate to say and I refrained from posting it earlier, but seeing as you don’t have anywhere to go with it.

I’d say the best bet would be to re-design the level itself and (note this is the part I hate) force the player to run around in the office complex. Have the tunnel at the end of the first toll gate collapse preventing transit (using rubble from the collapse in Apprehension? Or is there a generic destroyed wall?). Besides, there’s a tram at the end of the complex anyway.

It’s a last-resort option, but from the looks of things, it’s likely the best you can do at this point, unless you want to remove a lot of the props laying around the map.

There’s some pros and some cons to it.

Pros:

  1. Forcing the player to run through the office complex lets you get rid of the train paths underneath, if you so choose, I’d say have the track be partially destroyed before the off-to-the-side area so you can free up some entity space and get rid of the vehicle rout laid out in that area that’s blocked off from the tram while still keeping the tunnel.

  2. It allows for the map transition for A1 to be moved up to just before (or inside of) the office complex. Again, freeing up space.

  3. Allows for all of your hard work to be shown.

  4. Solves the backtracking issue.

  5. Solves a potential clipping/game breaking bug if both vehicles (the trams) use the track at the same time.

Cons:

  1. Removes the ability to run around on the track with the tram for a little while

  2. Deviates from Half-Life’s original level design.

That’s about all I can think of, it’s late on my end. But that looks the best option imo. Thoughts?

Founded in 2004, Leakfree.org became one of the first online communities dedicated to Valve’s Source engine development. It is more famously known for the formation of Black Mesa: Source under the 'Leakfree Modification Team' handle in September 2004.