Vortiguants still look like garbage :(

Black Mesa Archive The Cafeteria
#1

51c18ab3e1036
51c18ab3e10361691×657 301 KB

Inb4 “it looks fine, I was born with chronic glaucoma”

Can we just like finally get a visual update on the god damn slave-gear for the Vortigaunts? The gear on them is ancient and then ancient again for crying out loud. It’s not even in the final HL2 for more than a split second because it’s not even up to par with a game from 2004. Moreover, the Combine are the ones big on reproduction control, so just mindlessly bringing over the crotch plate kills any possible logic toward the separate motives of the foes you come up against in both games. It really looks mad ugly which is why none of these things can be forgiven.

I’m also not a fan of the “evolution-based” decision to fuck with the eyes on the bullsquid. The model you had before was fine. An amphibious creature that lives in a dimension where things float the hell around can have any fish-like eye structure it wants. The reasons behind the decisions to give the bullsquid alligator eyes makes me want to punch children. They look like DOOM enemies with their big silly lovecraft faces coming at me, both eyes on me like it’s a face on legs. But I mean… at least that’s not rocking 20 year old textures.

Also fortunate that the workshop has models like this to accustom people like me on that, but I mean, who the hell wants anything but Half Life in their Half Life?!dasgfdg

2 Likes
#2

Sweeping_Vort.jpg450×640 141 KB

The vortigaunt model is an updated version of the half life two vort model. As such it does look pretty good with the details as for your “notes” they are wrong, for one the slave collars seen in half life are the combine ones.

That is literally the tech on the final boss, The xenian’s while not combine, where enslaved by the combine and fled to xen. That slave collar, yeah that has always been combine tech, along with the crap on the final boss.

1 Like
#3

Complete hogwosh, mumbo-jumbo, and nonsense.
90% of what you said is you filling the gaps in the lore yourself.

They never had crotch-plates serving under the Controllers and honestly the Combine wasn’t even an idea during the development of those creatures. The Slave Collars bid them to the will of the Nihilanth and the Controllers, and the technology used by these creatures may be inspired by their enslavers, but they certainly aren’t just the same. Xen uses zerg-like eggs and more organic stuff like special waters and gene splicing. If you’re gonna gap the lore, it would be more interesting to assume the Nihilanth was using Earth as a staging point to build up a force to fight back against the Combine.

The Nihilanth wasn’t weak; he escaped likely because of his potential and the Combine couldn’t control something that could port around so easily. Vortigaunts, Grunts, Controllers, and the Nihilanth are all one similar species, mutated for military purposes in a similar but different fashion than the combine, almost inspired by the Combine entirely. Since the Vorts and Controllers aren’t mutated clearly, it’s safe to assume that they make the grunts where when we seem working in Interloper. That’s their war factory - not a Combine installation. The collars and all that other bullshit are likely made there too, as the visuals were originally similar to the armor shared by all Xenian forces. The Nihilanth is the only creature that would make sense to be at all possibly altered by the Combine since his modifications are extreme.

It seems to me that perhaps it removed most of the Combine stuff on it and had its followers replace what they could with their own technology, which is why it also blends in with the color tone of the Xenian Force’s armor. The Combine were still ways away and there’s really no feasible reason for any of their tech to be present. You certainly won’t be seeing anything like that with the release of Xen.

And no dude, they’re not updated. They’re the same models with the same low level input put into binding them to the Vort model. They have been retextured and recolored (barely) but they still clearly look like crap.

#4

Infected with leucocholy.

2 Likes
#5

Pedantic? On one of the major like 10 enemies in the game? Yeah I really don’t know about that dude. In fact, I’d like to hear you try to defend that position.

Everyone bitches when the MP5s float out of the HECU’s hands and shit, but when an actual enemy’s armor is just floating on their skin, I guess that’s just the cost of business ehhhh? Yeah, fuck right off with that no-thought knockdown attempt. You’re infected with compliance.

#6

Now, excuse me for presuming, but I was under the impression that a thread claiming the Vortigaunts still look like garbage would have less to do with arguing irrelevant headcanons and more about what, you know, the vortigaunt models actually look like.

I think they’re fine. The paler green metal and greyish skin tone fit the overall desaturated and dim aesthetic of Black Mesa in a way that the brown-and-bright-green original style does not. I personally would have made the metal elements more bio-organic looking, and altered the Nihilanth to match, but judging by the posted Interloper prop models the BM team has decided to include some mechanical technology in Xen and so it’s not a big deal.

2 Likes
#7

Yeah looks like they are going for a hybrid of mechanical and tech, sort of like the combine tech but with a heavier lean towards the biological then the mechanical.

I wouldn’t be opposed to a more organic looking slave collar on the vorts, but then again I like the current look. The way it looks makes me think it was made out of some advanced bio plastic or something. As it seems to limit what the vorts can do, as they can’t use the abilities we see them using in hl2 or EP2. I am guessing the slave collars limit their powers some how.

1 Like
#8

I don’t really mind too much that they copied Half life 2’s vortigaunt appearance greatly, seeing as it bridges the canon, but i do think their voice lines are a bit lacking. These vortigaunts are literal slaves in chains. A whole different breed from what we see in HL2. They should sound more sharp and hostile, barking alien military style orders to kill on sight that freaky orange looking dude with the guns and crowbar.
I don’t mind them communicating with the longer “Lannnng~” or “Tarrrr~” style voice when they are idle. But during combat we should hear those iconic HL1 style screams that make them sound terrifying. You know what they sound like.
“DYEIII!”
“OIOIOI!”
Graphically too i think they should look more feral and rugged. With them retaining their HL2 appearance completely it makes them look like you are killing the emancipated freedom fighters that fought with the rebels against the combine, when 20 years prior the vortigaunts appearance is supposed to reflect abused, yet fierce slaves. Consistently beat down by their controller overlords, yet having no qualms about using violence to kill whatever stands in their way.
So i do think some discussion about the vortigaunts is worth considering. There is some room for improvement.

Edit: Also i remember one qualm i had with the first contact of vortigaunts. This scene might have changed since i played it years ago, but i distinctly remember an scene, when the player teleports to Xen for 5 seconds during the resonance cascade. There’s a cutscene with the vorts looking at the player with their weird almost friendly looking eyes, looking at the player, then walking towards him and doing a waving gesture. It’s completely surreal and against the mood of the intense murdering and combat you’ll be doing against these guys later on. In Half life 1, this scene feels completely different. You suddenly materialize in front of 4 vort guys that were just chilling out in their familiar habitat when this inexplicable creature pops into existence. They just stand there staring at you in what is possibly one of the greatest “WTF?” Moment in their lives. That’s some great storytelling right there, and it shows the capabilities for great story without unnecesarry addition of cutscenes that don’t really make sense.
This shows the dissonance i’m talking about. The HL1 vorts act like HL2 vorts in their scripted behaviour, yet we use shotguns to blast them in the face a couple hours later, it’s such a odd and weird feeling of wasted potential.

5 Likes
#9

Yeah I could totally see that. Going along with the darker atmosphere of the game a lot of the Black Mesa choreographed combat elements seem to be a little slower-paced than HL, but that’s no excuse not to have some measure of aggression from the vorts which currently is somewhat lacing. Compared to the Marines, they seem almost like they’re sleepwalking.

1 Like
#10

Yeah THIS big time.

I’d love to see and overwhelming rehaul of added animations and AI for all the creatures. The whole Quiver idea, the ENTIRE reason for Half Life, was to simulate aliens coming into our world. They were supposed to exist independent of the player and breed, expand, explore, hunt, etc - all without the player even being there. Their ideas were similar to modern simulators and they were more ahead of their time than they could pull off before the game’s polish time was up.

I was thrilled to read that the vorts are going to be getting animations and stuff that make them look more sympathetic. I’m just hoping that maybe all Xen creatures get a bit more personality. Sometimes I want to relive the experience, not just see it again in HD, you feel me? Sometimes back then, subtle things were understood because of limitations, but today? You’re right, I’d love to see a cowering Vortiguant like in the original HL.

Now, excuse me for presuming, but I was under the impression that a thread claiming the Vortigaunts still look like garbage would have less to do with arguing irrelevant headcanons and more about what, you know, the vortigaunt models actually look like.

Not much to say there than what I already said I think? They’re like really low resoution, unclear visually, and HANGIN THE FLIP OFF the model. I’d literally be satisfied with a higher resolution skin, them copying the damn bracelets x2 so they go all the way around the wrist, and them removing the crotch rocket plate. Right now the vorts currently look like they have some high tech alien wrist watches. Also, how hard is it to remove the combine biotic crotch plate thing? Xen could fucking less about endless reproduction, doesn’t even fit their lore. Gives strange ideas about what they might be after, also. Wrong kind of use of that storytelling imo. How can you NOT bring up story there? They don’t look good and they’re not supposed to.

#11

While I agree with a good chunk of your points, you really don’t need to act so aggressive to everyone else here because they may or may not have a different point of view. Referring to others’ thoughts as “hogwosh, mumbo-jumbo, and nonsense” while telling them to fuck off makes you come off as childish.

This isn’t the Steam forums. We don’t talk like that here.

6 Likes
#12

I’ve been here since like 2009 or something and I don’t remember this place EVER being all that cheery, quite the opposite. I’ve seen some hilarious roasting go down here, but honestly? I was just calling the guy on his phony lore is all. I’m not clear on what the hell you’re talking about.

And dude, I didn’t tell anyone to “fuck off”, I’m pretty sure.
Maybe you just need to relax and have a nice cold drink? :upside_down_face:
Cold-Water
Psst, it's got alcohol in it.

#13

I’ve been here since like 2009 or something and I don’t remember this place EVER being all that cheery, quite the opposite.

940×282

Seems to me that there’s a good five year gap. Your other antagonistic posts beyond this thread’s appear to date back to 2012. Times change, especially when it’s been five entire years.

Also, I never said that you’re expected to act cheery. Acting like an adult and not having an aggressive attitude to everyone that disagrees with you does not require an upbeat attitude to accomplish.

I was just calling the guy on his phony lore is all.

You’re perfectly capable of refuting people without being unnecessarily aggressive to them.

And dude, I didn’t tell anyone to “fuck off”, I’m pretty sure.

3 Likes
#14

Holy shit lmao that’s not exactly the same as telling someone to fuck off. Was pretty much saying the IDEA of that can fuck off, but still, that’s no reason for you to be waving a flag right now.

No one was a victim until you came in here, so let’s maybe just get back on topic?
:face_with_raised_eyebrow:

Edit: did you look through my profile? You need to maybe get some better things to do with your time. I’m trying really hard not to make you any more upset but you’re being a real (edit: difficult fellowman).

#15

Now that things are going to start happening with the project, folks need to be aware there are going to be a LOT of opinions flying around.

That said… we will not allow personal attacks. Debate, discuss, and argue the topic, not the person(s). Play nice people. Allow others to have their opinions and don’t get butthurt.

personal-attack

Noun
( plural personal attacks)

  1. Making of an abusive remark on or relating to one’s person instead of providing evidence when examining another person’s claims or comments.
3 Likes
#16

I can officially say this topic is going to die.

#17

Catz, maybe you can help me? I can’t get passed Inbound because once your voice stops, I don’t want to play anymore. Any tips? <3

Anyways, they still look a lot worse than most things fans are putting out right now in the workshop. I’d almost forgive it if they just lined up the model to the wrists better and took away the crotch plate. Everything else is pretty acceptable after the updates.

But with all the rinkydink stuff in Xen, it really would be cool to see it get updated with one of the newer Xen looking models we’ll be seeing. For instance, there’s this pic going around of a chrome texture on the Black Mesa Nihilanth model’s seat-thing and it looks fucking spooky seeing all the details the devs added. I’d love to see something similiar on the vorts, maybe armor that looks more painful or something – anything but a near direct copy of HL2.

I can officially say this topic is going to die

JFC I mean, it’s nice and all that the same 2 people feel the need to remind me they disagree with me here, but if you look for it, it’s not like just my complaint. You don’t have to badger me with “well okay but that’s not nice”. SoSrybruh. Yeah nobody feels as strongly about it as I do, but so what? People love Black Mesa (including myself, I have hours logged like crazy probably), but there’s always been one or two tedious little complaints about this mod, (people usually talk shit on HECU or whatever, which I can see sometimes) but one of which I always stood by 100% was that the Vortiguants didn’t get the attention they deserved perhaps.

And most of that is being solved apparently in this new AI update with Xen, so there you go. I’m just asking for maybe an updated reskin and people are saying I’m petty cause I made a bold title and people came in with an opinion - it’s that mentality which I’m explicit toward. I think the way the vort’s armor is now is worth updating and the current one looks like crap and if fixed, the game will not suffer for it: that’s my opinion. Not to mention, last time I complained about this on the forums, years ago, like a week later they tinted the armor green officially - so they do care about giving things a chance.

I mean, besides the fact that I have to listen to Kelly Bailey while playing, I think Black Mesa hit the nail on the head after all these years of updates. And now besides the vorts (and maybe some eyeball decisions with the bsquid), I couldn’t come up with a bad thing to say about the game. I just think the vort’s armor kinda look like shit, because I mean, they’re not even mapped properly. Screw me, I guess.

#18

the vortigaunts look fine.

1 Like
#19


me rn

#20

Agreed, especially as, they look a lot more like the original once they are [spoiler see xen topic for details]

Founded in 2004, Leakfree.org became one of the first online communities dedicated to Valve’s Source engine development. It is more famously known for the formation of Black Mesa: Source under the 'Leakfree Modification Team' handle in September 2004.